royal zulu warrior

pirates Wrote:

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> jack and karel you both are 200 percent correct
> ...i would like to know from either from you if
> this ridiculous capping of ratings happens in any
> other countries...such as highest mr for a 4yo mdn
> winner is 70 the most you can penalise a plate
> race winner is 6 pounds and the most a handicap
> winner is 8 pounds etc....whats the use of having
> a system called MERIT RATINGS WHEN YOU CANNOT RATE
> HORSES ON MERIT..and also .please people dont
> bring up that the racing programme doesnt cater
> for progressive horses as the handicaper has
> nothing to do with the programme...


Spot on - are their any plans/intentions to revisit this ridiculous situation - and while they are at it look again at how the program is put together?

howcome a horse like perana was rated 93 after his second run (maiden juvenile plate which he won) & rzw was rated a 70 after 2 facile wins?

wonbyamile Wrote:

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> howcome a horse like perana was rated 93 after his
> second run (maiden juvenile plate which he won) &
> rzw was rated a 70 after 2 facile wins?

WFA. Royal Zulu Warrior is a 4yo.

It's a bad rule because it will only favor isolated horses against the many time and again.

To have a cap on the starting rating AND the incremental penalties is beyond a mistake, it's fraud. I don't know if there are rules like this in any other country, but I would be surprised to find one this bad out of Africa.

Every single time this happens, it smashes the intention of a handicap where the rule of the race is every poor nag is supposed to have a legitimate chance at the weights. The betting should be 4/1 the field, not 20c RZW. And those connections go back again and again with a rich import, to stand in the que for racing's equivalent of the homeless lining up for a plate of food.

I'm surprised that a canny Ramsden bothered to run a decent 3yo against RZW when he must have known the weight would break his runner, who would have won by 7L without the charity horse.

The irony is that one of the main architects of this patently unfair rule is the trainer who knew he would be sitting with maiden 4yo imports. Unless he's stupid and it's all just a co-incidence. How the NHRA allowed these rules to slither through despite the absolute objections of every handicapping source they used is beyond me. At this point only the embarrassment and shame they must feel when their peers see whats happening may cause a fix. Lets hope RZW can steal a few more charity Rands to show this up.

BTW, this isn't just a whinge, this is a fundamental flaw in the logic of our system. If we don't complain about this, we shouldn't bother about unfair stipes calls or whatever other infringements aggravate us. This isn't a judgement call, this is a disgrace that wouldn't happen anywhere else because normally people of knowledge and character would not stand for it.

after 3 runs & a combined winning distance of about 25lengths rzw must be something special... my question is after 1 race winning by over 9lengths why did they run him in 2 low mr races & not contest any feature races?

Magic, you are wrong.
WFA has no inluence on ratings, only when weights to be carried in a race are calculated.
A 97 2yo is the same as a 97 4yo, although they'll carry different weights in a handicap because of maturity deficit.

Very well said, Jack. As I've said before - and I know I'll get some people jumping on me from a great height for saying it - I would be quite happy to do away with all of these ridiculous caps and restrictions that have wormed their way into our handicapping system. They completely go against the grain of what handicapping should be, which as Jack noted is to give every horse at least a theoretical chance of winning. This is patently impossible when a horse who should be rated somewhere around 93 (at the very least) is running of a 78.

The handicappers are there to do a job, and there is more than one of them, so checks and balances are automatically in place. Let them rate horses as they see fit. However, the operators must also come to the party and offer a selection of non-handicap races. It seems to me that more conditions and other plated races are working their way into the programme, so on that score the operators are seemingly doing their bit.

What our handicapping rules allow for at the moment are for a 12 handicap golfer to take on Ernie Els - off a 2 handicap. RZW is an extreme example perhaps, but he is a very good example of just how badly the current system can go astray from "pure" handicapping. And I thought that a major part of implementing "real" handicapping in the first place was to prevent this sort of bullsh!t from happening. This is quite aside from the fact that RZW may or may not be a superstar. What is plain is to anybody with eyes in their head is that he is a far better horse than the handicappers are allowed to make him out to be. His opponents in the two handicaps that he has won had no chance - and that is EXACTLY what the system is supposed to avoid.

Karel Miedema Wrote:

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> Magic, you are wrong.
> WFA has no inluence on ratings, only when weights
> to be carried in a race are calculated.
> A 97 2yo is the same as a 97 4yo, although they'll
> carry different weights in a handicap because of
> maturity deficit.

Perena could never have been a nett 93 after winning a maiden juvenile plate.

magiclips Wrote:

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> Karel Miedema Wrote:
>

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>

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> > Magic, you are wrong.
> > WFA has no inluence on ratings, only when
> weights
> > to be carried in a race are calculated.
> > A 97 2yo is the same as a 97 4yo, although
> they'll
> > carry different weights in a handicap because
> of
> > maturity deficit.
>
> Perena could never have been a nett 93 after
> winning a maiden juvenile plate.


Magic... i got the info from formgrids...

perana..... www.formgrids.co.za/subscriber/fgHorseHist.aspx?b=y&hs=PERANA (AUS),ZA

rzw... www.formgrids.co.za/subscriber/fgHorseHist.aspx?b=y&hs=ROYAL ZULU WARRIOR (AUS),ZA

hi all

long time since a KZN horse received so much interest.If u guys missed the post race interview.....Vodo July planned.

The rule regarding 4yr olds has been around for quite some time,prior to RZW,and at any trainers liberty.
Personally,the riding arrangements has to change if this horse has to succeed.AD will be compelled to ride for MDK.

Wonbyamile, I never said your info was wrong. However, you would surely have had to subract the WFA factor for 2yo ver that distance at that time of year to arrive at Perana's nett MR. With a 4yo, the difference between nett and gross MR is zero.

Royal Zulu Warrior is nominated for the King's Cup 1600m next week Tuesday up against the likes of Tropical Empire, Winter's Night, River Lodge etc.