Magic, you have a point

Consenting humans have a choice. It's is that simple. To compare a horse being asked to compete in the Grand National to a human who goes snow boarding is pathetic.

Earlier this year Rocks Off perished in a flat race in South Africa after being champion 2yo of his season. It could be said he to should not have been subjected to running after his poor performances in Dubai. Rocks Off also never had a choice but he ran. Every year in flat thoroghbred racing horses become ill-fated but flat racing still goes on with little noise. Thoroughbred racing, breeding and all the industries associated with it is money spinning investments. As in mining every year there are deaths in that industry so will there be in our beloved sport. I for one dont enjoy any animal dying but the statistics will show every year the ratio of horses dying in any form of racing is a few and because it creates so many employment opportunities it will still go on.

P.S. Does this mean every animal should be roaming free in the wild with no human contact. I think not, there are to invaluable to us but there should be ways to preserve thier diginity.

Naresh
You picked on one horse last year and I am not sure what went wrong but will try and find out.2 died in this one race and I gather another put down later.3 deaths out of 40 runners cannot be justified under any circumstances.

There is always a risk, but those monstrous fences in the Grand National, coupled with the extreme distance of the race and the number of runners, elevates that risk to new and (in my humble view) unacceptable levels.

Another question is how many horses were badly hurt but did not need to be put down.To me any race where more than say 5%
of the runners cant finish must be looked at again and the problem sorted out.

Well Craig I think your last comment is a little more balanced

Just a few weeks ago I was watching a race on sand at Kimberley when one horse seemed to shatter it sfront right leg with the unfortunate and only end result

Does that make it a blood sport ?

And the euthanasing van has not been without a job at Kenilworth either this year ...so unfortunately whether it is flat or jumps the horse is at risk. Rocks Off was certainly not the only horse to be put down on a South African racecourse in the past twelve months

And if one adds up the deaths from injury in flat racing world wide .. where do we go with it ? How many are to be permitted ?

As the competition gets stronger .. more pressures are put on horses to perform .... more substances are used to improve their performance and one gets closer and closer to taking them to the "edge" so to speak

On balance i think Magic is correct in saying that the National errs on the side of being overly dangerous. I think one could still make it the ultimate steeple chase challenge
and moderate some of the fences and perhaps the distance ....... no doubt the authorities will be under lots of pressure to do just this.. having said all that I though it was a fabulous race in itself ..and was rooting for Sam Waley-Cohen to do the treble ....he came so close..and with AP breathing down their necks.....

Its odd how humans get killed off left right and centre ..... for any number of reasons .. sometimes with little or no outcry..and in the most desperate of circumstances

Perhaps they need an equivalent of the SPCA

Hi Badger,
For interest I will try get some figures from the NHA vet here on horses being put down for injuring themselves during their races.
In my 30 plus years in racing I can honestly only think of 2 horses of ours being put down during a race. It does happen but not anywhere nearly
as often as over jumps especially those size jumps. Let me see what I can find out and come back with some info.

Yes it was a good race, and the deaths are unfortunate thats for sure, but how many horses break down in training, flat racing etc. And Flat Racing isnt ever called a blood sport. Otherwise there should be a forum topic like this one every time we see a horse break down on TV. Just my 1 c worth.

Racing Post

Pace of National caused horse deaths say trainers

JUMP trainers Kim Bailey and Lucinda Russell have said the pace of the race was a contributing factor to the deaths of Dooneys Gate and Ornais, the two horses killed in Saturday's John Smith's Grand National.

The fallout of the race has been debated intensely in the media and racing industry, but the trainers were in agreement the fast time and hot weather were the primary reasons for the distressing scenes.

Speaking on his website, Bailey, who won the Grand National in 1990 with Mr Frisk in the fastest time in the race's history, said: "The race was run in the second fastest time in history.

"Speed always causes more horses to fall as they are racing one stride faster than normal and those fences are big.

"Sadly at the pace the race was run horses fell and however much we school over fences and try to eliminate these falls they still do happen.

"We trainers, owners, staff and jockeys love our horses and it is sad that two horses were killed but the exhaustion was weather-related."

Russell, who used her website to report her runner Silver By Nature to be "fine but bruised" after finishing 12th, added: "I'm not sure what Aintree can do to make the track and fences safer, other than to make the ground softer so that the horses run slower.

"Unfortunately, as in many things, speed increases danger."

Fellow trainer Charlie Longsdon praised the actions of jockeys who were seen checking the welfare of horses as soon as they had crossed the line.

"There probably hasn't been a hotter day for the National and after 4m4f there was a lot of potential to have distressed and dehydrated horses after the race," said Longsdon on his website.

"Amid all the euphoric scenes the jockeys who had fallen were seen running around pouring water on the horses who had completed.

"Davy Russell was the most notable, grabbing the winner [Ballabriggs] as it started to look slightly wobbly and he dragged the horse around to keep it on the move and stop it trying to lie down.

"It just shows how jockeys are not just amazingly brave and tough professionals, but are also caring horsemen, who view the welfare for their horses as paramount to the welfare of the sport."

magiclips Wrote:

---

> The scary thing is that the Grand National fences
> have been softened over the years, Heaven knows
> what they were before - Table Mountain covered in
> branches?

Racing legend Ginger McCain trainer of Red Rum said safety measures, including reducing ‘drops’ on the landing side of fences, had inadvertently made it more dangerous. The veteran trainer, whose son Donald trained Saturday’s winner Balabriggs, said: ‘It’s getting quicker and it’s speed that does it… They’ve taken the drops out for the do-gooders and it has encouraged the horses to go quicker. It is speed that kills.’

Tipster Wrote:

---

> magiclips Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > The scary thing is that the Grand National
> fences
> > have been softened over the years, Heaven
> knows
> > what they were before - Table Mountain covered
> in
> > branches?
>
> Racing legend Ginger McCain trainer of Red Rum
> said safety measures, including reducing
> ‘drops’ on the landing side of fences, had
> inadvertently made it more dangerous. The veteran
> trainer, whose son Donald trained Saturday’s
> winner Balabriggs, said: ‘It’s getting quicker
> and it’s speed that does it… They’ve taken
> the drops out for the do-gooders and it has
> encouraged the horses to go quicker. It is speed
> that kills.’


This,the stayers get taking of their feet in this,when was the last time a 4 mile chaser won the national?

Just getting back to Badger and anyone else interested. Our Kwazulu Natal NHRA Vet has just confirmed that an average of 6
horses a year(about 120 or so race meetings) are put down due to injuries suffered during a race on our 3 courses. Will leave it to
you people to make your own mind on the subject.