Confused....Calling all trainers

Pirates, I hear what you say and that sounds a very plausable explanation, I also note GB's comment. My problem with it is that like many people who like a punt I simply don't have that good an in depth knowledge of horses and owner/trainer/jockey relationships... so, how am I meant to know? Would it have been too much trouble for someone to have explained that before the race? Now, you may say, that's my fault for not having/obtaining that knowledge and to extent I would agree but, I hope there is an appreciation that it is not easy for everyone and there are some of us who are genuinely more interested in a punt than in the horses etc.

For whatever reason, almost daily there is a winner in SA that I simply can't fathom and it naturally makes me suspicious. I do try and take into account that my knowledge is limited and therefore there may well be a decent explanation that the likes of yourself would know. I am also abroad so my tv coverage is limited to a few minutes before and after a race and therefore I don't hear all that is said. So, I don't come on here moaning when it happens. I simply do my five minutes in the pram, head-butt the wall, accept it and move on to the next race. I also think the post-race interviews in SA with jocks and trainers are excellent. That said, I do wish that sometimes they would ask how a donkey with three legs using a zimmerframe to get around the paddock manages to turn up at the race course and cosily win a race against some pretty useful horses, I understand why they don't ask those questions, but do the powers that be in SA racing ask those questions? Probably not I fear.

There are clearly a lot of people on this forum with a great deal of knowledge about racing in SA, it is one of the main reasons I joined. But, please remember that we don't all have that knowledge so don't be too harsh on us when something happens that seems a little strange to us but actually has a "hidden" and acceptable explanation Apologies if I have bored anyone to death...

I would think that having a top jock on your horse gives it a better chance of winning or then at least place even though they
[top jocks] do earn [cost if you like] more
As an owner i'd pay that 3% more... In for a penny, in for a pond,i'd say! not penny wise and pound foolish!

BC we are always looking for those horses, but they are not easy to find but will keep looking. Englander I also see horses winning that I think how did that win but that is what racing is about. There will always be one that is just right on the day and the favourites are just not and the outsider will win. Jp I did Mark Khan's rides to help him out for awhile and he said to me he would rather relax in the jockey room then ride horse with little chance. I think most if not all the top jockeys feel the same way. There a plenty jockeys that do the hard work in the mornings that need those rides so trainers should rather put them on.

Thanks for your time and effort to reply CE it's appreciated and fair,after all I am also one that feels for them,especially when theres no loyalty. It was only an opinion

Have a nice day!!!(tu)

Yes, Gregbucks, correct.
But never discount our stable jock by assuming that we never wanted Striker on that ride or that we dont give that horse a chance. Chase will definitely get his winners and his chances.

Striker and my relationship goes back to our youth in Racing and back to 1988 when I brought him up here, from PE. Over the years we have built a very special understanding of Racing, ''our way'' as such. We also understand each other. Very much the same as the relationship which I was priveleged to build with the late Buddy Maroun.

Both Piere and the late Buddy Maroun had the same gift in Racing. They achieved the highest standards, yet they always SIMPLIFIED Racing. With them, a common sense approach to Racing made success easier to achieve.

The modern Racing Game is very tough. We chase Stake cheques, for our Owners. We dont have time to play games, so we look for every inch in a race. This is why a Stable jock, who works with the horses daily and knows them very well is so important, when we cannot get Striker.

englander u make a very valid point abt sa racing.the trick is to know who the suspect jocks are and to be careful of them coz u never know.in jhb there are the most suspect jocks and if u follow racing there u will realise that these jocks always find traffic problems,put in there runs to late and always an excuse.i hv realised that certain jocks r definately in the pockets of the bookies and i know everyone on here will disagree but i hv come to this conclusion after watching most races on the highveld.there are only a few jocks who imo are not part of the click and who ride true.bear in mind this is my opinion and how i play horses wen it comes to jhb racing.the stipes never ever question rides and some of there rulings on objections are so laughable its really a joke.in fact i dont even know y they hv stipes and nha because they are clearly not doing there jobs and as long as they get pd let the game go on and avoid all controversy and anything that brings a negative image to the sport of kings.

CE, with all due respect, and I sincerely mean respect, I understand and accept that. I tell my partner when she asks why I have so many seconds and not firsts that I (or the market) may well be able to choose the best horse in a race given all known factors but I can't account for a horse that just wakes up and feels that today is his... or her ... day. That indeed is part of racing. But, yesterday for example, I thought Muzi Yeni had some pretty decent chances and Muzi is a jockey I like a lot. I backed both Paris Symphony (my best e/w shot of the day) and Three Captains only for both to be beaten into second by 40-1 and 28-1 shots respectively. The race commentator said of the first that blinkers must have made all the difference and that the winner of the second was just right on the day. Now, one of those I find hard to accept and do accept, the second I find very very hard to accept and I'm still struggling with it. I don't think I will need to tell anyone here which is which. Now obviously I am not looking for you to respond on these individual cases but I would expect SA Racing to be looking at it a little more closely shall we say. It may very well be above board etc, and the likes of Pirates may well be better informed than me and have a good explanation but, the image and perception, so important to racing in general, is not good. Not because of the example above but because it is not a rare event.
Winzip, thanks for the comments, I have to be honest though and say I can't be sure what happens, how or where, I just don't have time to examine each race that closely. I definitely suspect there is a strong possibility there is at least some truth in what you say though but, even if there isn't, it is important to respond to these suspicions and put in place measures that will help eradicate them. That is all punters can ask.
Again, to those being bored to death... my apologies

Englander, I am not arguing nor defending anyone here. However, I must ask you two questions~
1) When the odds on favourite gets beaten by a very long shot in Dubai, where there is no betting, do your suspicions also apply etc?
2) Ditto elsewhere in World Racing?

Englander I understand your frustration but it will never stop happening and often the trainer is the most surprised by the run. As I was told years ago this is called racing not winning the same as throwing a line and hook into the water is called fishing not catching! If those 2 horses run badly next time out then I agree the Stipes should ask some questions.

Hi Louis. I never bet in Dubai and know nothing of the racing there so it would be unfair of me to say. But I certainly used to ask those questions years ago back in the UK, less so now. And CE, just been on the second again beaten by a 55/1 shot! and I think that is a fair example of where the trainer may be more surprised than anyone. Done my head-butt and on to the next
Guys, please remember I actually posted originally mostly in support of the original poster as I think sometimes your average punter is a lot less in the know that the likes of Pirates whose knowledge I can only respect and learn from. In the same way you are not defending anyone Louis, I am not really here trying to attack anyone - though I realise I am kind of doing so - I am sure everything is not 100% as it should be but that is sadly part of the game now and true of pretty much all sports. All I would ask is that there is greater scrutiny and I think that can only be good for all.

And well done with Silly Mid-On, Louis safe to say, I was on the second yet again, Western Way

Was there no confidence for Silly mid on ? Started @ 16-1 with striker up