how destructive are bookies and the open bet

Tipster Wrote:

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> scotia Wrote:
>

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>

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> > Difficult to answer in a few lines but IMO the
> > open bet does damage horseracing, so the
> question
> > is why do punters use it?
> >
> > My reply would be because the punter gets a
> better
> > service from a bookie and basically gets
> ignored
> > by the operators.
> >
> > I do not go anywhere to punt except of line and
> we
> > have limited choices in Pretoria but I have
> > visited the old shop of Prinsloo in water glen
> and
> > it was taken over by the tote and is a dive
> with
> > no facilities for the clients, then after about
> a
> > year the bookie arrived Betting World and its
> > still a shit hole due to being run by the
> > operator. When I say no facilities not even a
> cold
> > drink or a packet of chips.
> >
> > You have seen my photos and visits to
> Hollywood,
> > Fouries etc and they have fully licensed, super
> > food outlets for the comfort of the punters.
>
> So what you are saying is that the operators must
> put on the show by funding racecourses, training
> centres, organising the races, TV coverage, the
> vast majority of stakes etc and still compete at a
> service level on their off course premises with
> the personal business of a bookmaker (some of whom
> compound the problem further by laying the open
> bet)?

Only if you want to survive!!.............if the current management cannot run a successful business with even the present turnovers ,its time to let a new team have a try!
It is amazing how victimized the racing operators seem to feel..............they were handed an operating industry and they have just continued to sink it.................they created the need for the open bet...........totes closed at 11:30am and bookmakers worked throughout the meetings...they gave tote customers the service they needed.......you snooze you lose,so they say.

not to mention the poor telephone service and toteboard on the website is still not fixed...

My point is that the service level is compared to that of a bookmaker whose only expense is usually from one outlet.The thread is about the open bet and that is part of the problem.

BUT if there was a better experience in the totes (service level) then your product will sell itself, until then the punter doesn't care a sh!t about the open bet and will continue to use facilities that appeal to them imo...

I was using the example and there might be more? I live in the eastern suburbs of Pretoria and we have a bookie on the Lynwood Road, Vish, I have not been there for a couple of years but I am sure it's still a pleasant venue for punters, fully licensed and food for the punters, the other one is in Waterglen and Betting World is also a bookie and is a dive, happy to take pics

Now where would the punter go?

The Lounge where I punt and all of its branches have now gone the open bet route. There areno more tote machines in these outlets. What interests me about this change is is what do TAB and P feel about this? These 3 outlets were doing huge tote turnover now all of a sudden that disappears . Are they not concerned? Must be honest cannot blame the lounge boys for going this route as TAB didn't ever give a shit about the customers anyway. I would say that all the customers at this outlet are not worried about the change . The service is great and at least now should you win at least you get paid. Sorry but P need to catch a huge wake up. ( I think there may be one tote machine in these outlets for soccer 6 etc but no racing bets allowed)

Tote competitor would see P in the dwang...()

bloodshot Wrote:

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> The Lounge where I punt and all of its branches
> have now gone the open bet route. There areno more
> tote machines in these outlets. What interests me
> about this change is is what do TAB and P feel
> about this? These 3 outlets were doing huge tote
> turnover now all of a sudden that disappears . Are
> they not concerned? Must be honest cannot blame
> the lounge boys for going this route as TAB didn't
> ever give a shit about the customers anyway. I
> would say that all the customers at this outlet
> are not worried about the change . The service is
> great and at least now should you win at least you
> get paid. Sorry but P need to catch a huge wake
> up. ( I think there may be one tote machine in
> these outlets for soccer 6 etc but no racing bets
> allowed)

You are garunteed the full payment if you win on the Tote but if you win the Open Bet it is subject to limits so the highlighted part of your comment is confusing. How many punters have been caught out by the ambiguous wording of the bookmaker limits too. e.g if the limit on a quartet is R50,000, it pays R200,000 and you get 10% you don't get paid R20,000 you get paid R5,000.

Tipster Wrote:

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> My point is that the service level is compared to
> that of a bookmaker whose only expense is usually
> from one outlet.The thread is about the open bet
> and that is part of the problem.


..........and ofcourse the soccer bets (sports bets in general) belonged to the bookies.
This was never a tote product in the old days.

agra Wrote:

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> Tipster Wrote:
>

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>

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> > My point is that the service level is compared
> to
> > that of a bookmaker whose only expense is
> usually
> > from one outlet.The thread is about the open
> bet
> > and that is part of the problem.
>
>
> ..........and ofcourse the soccer bets (sports
> bets in general) belonged to the bookies.
> This was never a tote product in the old days.

Yes, but as Rob Faux said instead of dwelling on the problems of the Open Bet they must find solutions and the soccer bet is one of them.

Ok Tipster let me clarify what I said. I have been punting in this outlet for a long time and if you even win R1000 rand on a Tuesday it was hard to get paid the next day in cash. We are either told to come back later or accept a voucher. Why the hell should we accept that? You pay cash for your bet yet when you return to collect you are told sorry no cash. I have witnessed this with first time punters time and again at big meetings like the July and Summer Cup. Imagine what these people feel like who have their once a year bet and pay in cash yet can't collect?. Sorry I may be wrong here but I believe in this outlet I and all others are not subject to the so called limits that you refer to but I may be open to correction. What's more important is that while we all agree that the open bet is wrong for every reason ( it clearly does not help owners who pour money into the game ) it makes no difference to the everyday punter who buy the way TAB and P seem to have little regard for. We get great service and a place that is conducive to having a great afternoon or evening with a facility that makes you want to return. Sorry to say that most of P s outlets are a disgrace. I accept again that the open bet is not good for everyone but untill P or TAB look at themselves the bookies and the everyday punter will do what's best for themselves.

That's like asking a consumer to keep on coming back to your store even though the service is not great... You see it has nothing to do with the open bet really but how P treat there customers... Unfortunately they are too thick to see this!!!