well done corne spies

pirates Wrote:

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> just remember you see the winners but nobody knows
> how many 2yos are smashed before they come to the
> racecourse because they been pushed way to early
> ...you want a trainer like this good luck to you
> if you havent got patience or you cannot afford to
> keep your younger horses until they are ready then
> go find another hobby...


Also true - I am not for one moment suggesting that babies should be pushed to the point of breakdown, but why is it that these days there seems to be less and less juveniles racing - surely the horse population does not change, there must be the same number of 'early types' as 10 years ago - is it because the trainers are sleeping ? The 'early types' must run, the others must be given an opportunity to strenghen up (tu)

Frodo Wrote:

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> pirates Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > just remember you see the winners but nobody
> knows
> > how many 2yos are smashed before they come to
> the
> > racecourse because they been pushed way to
> early
> > ...you want a trainer like this good luck to
> you
> > if you havent got patience or you cannot afford
> to
> > keep your younger horses until they are ready
> then
> > go find another hobby...
>
>
> Also true - I am not for one moment suggesting
> that babies should be pushed to the point of
> breakdown, but why is it that these days there
> seems to be less and less juveniles racing -
> surely the horse population does not change, there
> must be the same number of 'early types' as 10
> years ago - is it because the trainers are
> sleeping ? The 'early types' must run, the others
> must be given an opportunity to strenghen up (tu)


Mrs Heminng, Ferraris, Maroun all raced babies early so if you know what you are doing then nothing wrong with it at all - And again I will site one of the greatest horses and sires of all time

Native Dancer (March 27, 1950 - November 16, 1967), nicknamed the Grey Ghost, was one of the most celebrated and accomplished Thoroughbred racehorses in history and was the first horse made famous through the medium of television. As a two-year-old, he was undefeated in his nine starts for earnings of $230,495, a record for a two-year-old. During his three years of racing, he won 21 of 22 starts.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_Dancer

As a trainer you must balance what is best for the horse first and then the owner - If you have a horse with limited ability then better to try early and if nothing shows retire the horse and give the horse a better life and save the owner money.

i say treat each horse as an individual if it tells you its ready then step up its work if it isnt give it more time ...if you rush a horse it will make you wait...

Australia, southern hemisphere like ourselves, schedule their biggest 2-yo feature before we have even run our 1st maiden juvenile plate of the season.

boys pirates speak the language all trainers speak and he is no wrong. let me put another way. when i start buy horse in the 70's their is the national yearling sale and the 2yo sale. there is no ready to run no cape sale is these two sale. when i buy horse from the yearling sale EVERY horse I buy go back to the farm where he is come from often with no charge for board up to 6 month the horse is leave to grow and strengthen up or the horse go to the spell farm. the 2yo sale is same but if you buy the horse with the speed pedigree it go to spell farm to be prepare. may be 3 or 4 month later it is go to trainer and he begin career. today is the joke. the horse that is buy from the yearling sale many go straight to the training yard. why? be cause the trainer have empty box and no other reason. to me this is the screwing of the owner no other way to look at it and is all so the screwing of the horse the yearling i dont care what care he get is never better be in the trainer yard. so now pirate give us the usual rubbish about the break down the horse and patience. many horse are buy for cheep be cause of breed and looks and the best chance they have to earn is early soup meat race. these is no the route for the million rand horse we all now these. what you do with speed sires like var and trippi pirates? you "give time"? you no can treat all horse the same that is for sure. so for me corne do what is right for owner and he give hem the return. is my opinion. if i buy the 50k horse at ready to run i now where i send hem. it is no to trainers who all ready in february do no even have a 2yo nominate yet.

all so to talk about patience so mr pirates now i am talking of experience. many many time the patience is show and the 3yo get to the track after the year or more of "patience" and is the soup meat. what then mr pirates? do the owner get any thing for hes patience besides the apo piso? these game is the 2 way street when you paying 6k a month and that is the cheep one these days you deserve to be look after by trainer no get screwed. is my opinion

sadly mr flash you are an extremely sour owner and also punter its pretty obvious you chose the wrong trainers to send your horses to or you went into ownership with the wrong attitude ...iv enjoyed my times as an owner and dont expect returns on investment ,iv met wonderful people through ownership and had plenty great times and some depressing moments but i wouldnt change it for anything...feel for you flash

pirates do not confuse the sour with the experienced, let any owner come on hear who has owned many horse and tell me hes experience is diferent to me. your coment about trainers i am afraid is all so incorrect. some of the example i give come from top 5 trainer. these game i am afraid is be come the con the owner game. for me if any owner have the moderate breed horse that the owner say these will take time, he is growing into hemself, hes look for ground i have the best advice you ever have. get out fast.

flash you can pick rogue trainers just like you can pick rogue financial consultants whether they in the top 5 or bottom 5 ...you think horses are robots you just pressa button and they go sorry they flesh and blood ..anyway you have had much more of this so called experience than me so who am i to argue with you ...pity so much bad experiences

Frodo Wrote:

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> Corne not my favorite trainer, but I have to admit
> that he has spotted a gap - these days there are
> less and less juveniles racing, so the opportunity
> is there to recoup outlay very early - and if the
> horses are average, they will not get a better
> opportunity to win than early on.
>
> Another guy who is not my cup of tea, but who has
> to be commended is Leon Erasmus, I think I'm right
> in saying that the vast majority of the horses in
> his stable cost less than R100k and the majority
> of those are given every opportunity to (and does
> mostly) turn a profit for their owners

Frodo I do not know what your "gripe" is with this 2 trainers as I had horses with both of them and my time with them were nothing but joy. Both of them are honest trainers, they will tel you straight if your horse is a "no hoper", you see your horse run often and even if they ran 5th it helps to get bills paid
Leon once phoned me and told me he has a horse that is for sale , he told me the horse has one win left, the price was R20 000 , I bought the horse, the horse won a race, I made a packet and then sold it..

how many times you hear saun tarry thank chris van niekerk for giving him and the horse the time to develop to furnish to get over this injury....

JAMES BLOND Wrote:

---

> Frodo Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > Corne not my favorite trainer, but I have to
> admit
> > that he has spotted a gap - these days there
> are
> > less and less juveniles racing, so the
> opportunity
> > is there to recoup outlay very early - and if
> the
> > horses are average, they will not get a better
> > opportunity to win than early on.
> >
> > Another guy who is not my cup of tea, but who
> has
> > to be commended is Leon Erasmus, I think I'm
> right
> > in saying that the vast majority of the horses
> in
> > his stable cost less than R100k and the
> majority
> > of those are given every opportunity to (and
> does
> > mostly) turn a profit for their owners
>
> Frodo I do not know what your "gripe" is with this
> 2 trainers as I had horses with both of them and
> my time with them were nothing but joy. Both of
> them are honest trainers, they will tel you
> straight if your horse is a "no hoper", you see
> your horse run often and even if they ran 5th it
> helps to get bills paid
> Leon once phoned me and told me he has a horse
> that is for sale , he told me the horse has one
> win left, the price was R20 000 , I bought the
> horse, the horse won a race, I made a packet and
> then sold it..


I do not have a 'gripe' with either of them - for me personally though it is rather like choosing between cars - I know probably nothing wrong with BMW, but I just don't 'like' them, so I will never drive one - personal choice