Equus awards 2015

Bob Brogan wrote: All the panel had equall footing Rob...

Theory and practice are seldom the same ...................

1) handicappers rated Legal Eagle 7 points ahead of French Navy and it beat French Navy in every 3yr old event .The only blemish for Legal Eagle was when badly baulked in the July..........the handicappers had given their "opinion" long before the awards!
2)Captain of All was raised to a 126 based on the last run before the awards ............Futura has been reduced to a 119...............explain how "IMMATERIAL OF DISTANCE" Futura can be rated ahead of CoA. (Legislate also had the edge over Futura "IMMATERIAL OF DISTANCE"?)
You have to conclude that sprinters and milers are subjectively regarded as secondary,and therefore making distance material!

The worry is that,having elected to utilise the MR model to determine the ability of all horses racing in South Africa and then supporting the handicapping team generally(and rightly so IMO .........without a doubt the most competent area of the industry) suddenly we have certain invitation races or award ceremonies,whereby the ratings are regarded as irrelevant.......Why?
Well, if the ratings had been the determining factor the Joostes would probably have prevailed in at least 3 more categories and I suspect,a subjective "spread it around" factor,which will obviously be denied,came into play! :evil:

naresh wrote:

rob faux wrote:

naresh wrote: With a human element in chosing the winners there's always going to be contraversy in it. At a quick glance Alboran Sea beats Captain of All in two Grade ones that she met him but does not win the award. Seems a future sire with and Equus award attached to it seems more enticing!!!

Alboran Sea beat Captain of All at handicap conditions ,receiving weight .............Captain of All was still the "winner" of those contests at WFA terms!

I'm not a handicap fundi but the race in Cape Town and the Computaform Sprint are WFA races so after the sex allowances and WFA scale thats how it received weight so how can it be termed "handicap".

So later this month in the Nunthorpe in the UK which is a sprint there is a 2yo filly Acapulco from America which is all the rage and if she wins it's because she was handicapped to win cos of her allowances or due to the wfa scale and weights. Thanks.

Sorry Naresh,I perhaps explained my point badly ..........the category states REGARDLESS OF AGE OR SEX so I am assuming they must judge the results of those races EXCLUDING allowances for either! WFA and sex allowance are both handicapping factors!

Since the last post ,Longines ,as respected international raters of racehorses ,included Captain of All in its top 20 horses in the world (@no 17)......................but not our horse of the year.........................seriously guys!!

(No sign of Alboren Sea,so might also help answer your question Naresh!)

Rob but Captain of All, received its current rating in the two races that Alboran Sea was not part off.

ROB not sure who paid LONGNINES for that rating

Bob Brogan wrote: ROB not sure who paid LONGNINES for that rating

Really ...............5 points less than rated by NHA so not sure I understand your point!

rob faux wrote:

Bob Brogan wrote: ROB not sure who paid LONGNINES for that rating

Really ...............5 points less than rated by NHA so not sure I understand your point!

There is a couple of world class travellors rated lower than him this years July Cup winner for one

Just think its and incredible rating for a horse thats won a few egg n sppon races in SAF ( albeit a very good last run )

Bob Brogan wrote:

rob faux wrote:

Bob Brogan wrote: ROB not sure who paid LONGNINES for that rating

Really ...............5 points less than rated by NHA so not sure I understand your point!

There is a couple of world class travellors rated lower than him this years July Cup winner for one

Just think its and incredible rating for a horse thats won a few egg n sppon races in SAF ( albeit a very good last run )

I never did agree with the 126......I have him at 122!
What rating would you give him .......and how would you justify the figure?

phew cant believe what im reading here ..cpt of all last 2 wins were the same 2 wins that the other ordinary sprinter jj the jet plane achieved before leaving south Africa..they both won a group 1 HANDICAP and then the mercury sprint on their coconuts ..how this horse wasn't horse of the year is pathetic cos he is the best 6 furlong sprinter since jj and we all know how jj did overseas ..his last 2 wins and I hardly ever use this term were NOTHING SHORT OF WORLD CLASS ..believe me lesser sprinters from this country have held their own overseas

pirates wrote: phew cant believe what im reading here ..cpt of all last 2 wins were the same 2 wins that the other ordinary sprinter jj the jet plane achieved before leaving south Africa..they both won a group 1 HANDICAP and then the mercury sprint on their coconuts ..how this horse wasn't horse of the year is pathetic cos he is the best 6 furlong sprinter since jj and we all know how jj did overseas ..his last 2 wins and I hardly ever use this term were NOTHING SHORT OF WORLD CLASS ..believe me lesser sprinters from this country have held their own overseas

But I know you also don't agree with the 126...................you posted that on a thread a few weeks ago!..................how close are you to the Longines 121?

Criteria. Consistency, rationality.


This is an open letter mailed in the hope of progress and not criticism. Please read it without prejudice.

The following questions are pondered over.

1. Champion Sprinter

ALBORAN SEA (AUS) MR 116 defeated the winner of said award x 2 over 1000m
Age: 3 (at last run)
Sex: f
M/Rating: 116 (at last run)
Owner: Mrs M Slack & Mr M B Javett
Breeder: Rosemont Stud, Vic
Trainer: M F De Kock
Breeding: Rock Of Gibraltar (IRE) - Lady's Light (USA) by Toolighttoquit (USA)
Colours: Black, orange spot, black sleeves, red armbands and cap
Date of last run: 2015-05-23
Next race: Not carded
Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2014-04-29 Clairwood Park 1000 0 58.0 A 3 1 -0.75 *TAPAWAY Muzi Yeni 57.60 14/1 14/10 Good R78000 - Juv Plate (Mdn 2 yr old Fillies) | Main | Turf
2014-05-24 Scottsville 1200 58.0 A 2 1 -2.25 *RICH GIRL (AUS) Muzi Yeni 69.45 25/1 12/1 Good R600000 - Grade 1 (2 yr old Fillies) | Main | Turf
2014-07-05 Greyville 1400 58.0 A 1 2 0.25 BILATERAL Muzi Yeni 85.33 2/1 5/4 Unknown (N) ZULU KINGDOM EXPLORER GOLDEN SLIPPER (Grade 1) (For 2 year-old Fillies)
2014-07-26 Greyville 1600 58.0 A 7 9 6.70 SAME JURISDICTION Anthony Delpech 97.96 16/10 12/10 Unknown (N) THEKWINI STAKES (Grade 1) (For 2 year-old Fillies)
2014-10-28 Turffontein 1000 109 51.0 A 7 1 -2.75 *WINTER PASSION Anthony Delpech 55.84 9/20 1/3 Good SUN INTERNATIONAL CONDITIONS PLATE (F and M) (For Fillies and Mares)
2014-11-15 Turffontein 1160 109 56.0 A 6 4 2.75 JET BELLE Anthony Delpech 69.61 5/10 11/20 Slightly Soft RACING. IT'S A RUSH PINNACLE STAKES (Open to all horses)
2014-12-06 Kenilworth 1000 109 56.0 A 2 2 0.50 FLY BY NIGHT Anthony Delpech 58.30 16/10 11/10 Good TONY TABERER SOUTHERN CROSS STAKES (WFA) (Grade 2) (For Fillies and Mares)
2015-01-24 Kenilworth 1000 111 54.0 A 2 1 -0.05 *CAPTAIN OF ALL Weichong Marwing 56.53 7/2 28/10 Good BETTING WORLD CAPE FLYING CHAMPIONSHIP (WFA)(Gr 1) (Weight For Age)
2015-04-25 Turffontein 1000 111 55.5 A 13 1 -0.70 *CARRY ON ALICE Anthony Delpech 55.59 7/2 6/1 Slightly Soft COMPUTAFORM SPRINT (Grade 1) (Weight for Age)
2015-05-23 Scottsville 1200 116 58.5 A 9 2 1.75 CARRY ON ALICE Anthony Delpech 69.41 15/10 16/10 Good CITY OF PIETERMARITZBURG FILLIES SPRINT (Grade 1) (For Fillies and Mares at Weight-For-Age)


CAPTAIN OF ALL

Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2013-04-28 Scottsville 1000 ? 58.0 A 5 2 0.15 KOCHKA Sean Cormack 57.68 5/2 18/10 Good R72K- MAIDEN JUVENILE PLATE For 2 year-olds
2013-05-19 Clairwood Park 1200 ? 58.0 A 8 1 -5.00 *APPLE PIE Sean Cormack 69.86 8/10 1/3 Good Clairwood: R72K- MAIDEN JUVENILE PLATE 2yolds

2013-05-25 Scottsville 1200 ? 58.0 A 8 1 -1.00 *WILLOW MAGIC (AUS) Sean Cormack 68.10 25/2 9/1 Good R600K- TSOGO SUN MEDALLION (Grade 1) For 2 year-olds
2013-07-06 Greyville 1400 ? 58.0 A 8 3 0.30 FOREST INDIGO Sean Cormack 86.31 3/1 7/2 Unknown R600K- GOLDEN HORSESHOE (Grade 1) 2yolds
2013-11-06 Kenilworth 1200 114 59.0 A 1 1 -2.50 *HUNTING HORN Sean Cormack 72.43 11/10 5/10 Good R60450- GRADUATION PLATE
2014-12-06 Kenilworth 1100 108 61.0 A 4 6 3.10 DRESSED IN COTTON Sean Cormack 65.74 18/10 22/10 Good VAL DE RA SOUTHEASTER SPRINT (Listed) (Open)
2014-12-06 Kenilworth 1100 108 61.0 A 4 6 3.10 DRESSED IN COTTON Sean Cormack 65.74 18/10 22/10 Good VAL DE RA SOUTHEASTER SPRINT (Listed) (Open)
2014-12-27 Kenilworth 1200 108 60.0 A 4 1 -0.40 *COPPER PARADE Sean Cormack 73.30 12/1 15/2 Good KHAYA STABLES DIADEM STAKES (WFA) (Grade 2) (Open To All Horses at Weight For Age)
2015-01-24 Kenilworth 1000 116 60.0 A 9 2 0.05 ALBORAN SEA (AUS) Sean Cormack 56.54 4/1 9/2 Good BETTING WORLD CAPE FLYING CHAMPIONSHIP (WFA)(Gr 1) (Weight For Age)
2015-03-29 Scottsville 1000 116 61.5 A 1 1 -7.50 *RICH GIRL (AUS) Sean Cormack 55.96 11/20 1/3 Very Soft RACING. IT'S A RUSH PINNACLE STAKES (Open to all horses)
2015-04-25 Turffontein 1000 116 60.0 A 9 3 4.00 ALBORAN SEA (AUS) Sean Cormack 56.28 3/1 16/10 Slightly Soft COMPUTAFORM SPRINT (Grade 1) (Weight for Age)
2015-05-23 Scottsville 1200 116 60.0 A 9 1 -1.25 *GULF STORM Sean Cormack 69.17 3/1 7/2 Good TSOGO SUN SPRINT (Grade 1) (Merit Rated Handicap)
2015-07-18 Greyville 1200 120 60.0 A 7 1 -4.50 *CARRY ON ALICE Greg Cheyne 70.84 2/1 2/1 Unknown (N) THE MERCURY SPRINT (Grade 1) (Horses at Weight-For-Age)



2. Champion stayer

WILD ONE MR 100 compared with Legal Eagle 116 prior to the Jubilee, now 120. What about Horse Chestnut and Elusive Fort who both won derbies and won stayers award over the Gold Cup.
Age: 6 (at last run)
Sex: g
M/Rating: 100 (at last run)
Owner: Mr S W Phillips
Breeder: Scott Bros
Trainer: M F De Kock
Breeding: Mogok (USA) - Endangered Species by Sapieha (IRE)
Colours: Yellow, red stars, hooped sleeves and cap
Date of last run: 2015-08-01
Next race: Not carded
Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2012-10-10 Clairwood Park 1450 ? 58.0*0.0 A 9 1 -0.75 *RED ROVER Keagan De Melo 90.99 25/1 48/10 Unknown Clairwood: R60K- MAIDEN PLATE (3yolds)
2012-11-18 Clairwood Park 1600 78 56.0 A 8 3 4.75 LOVE STRUCK Piere Strydom 96.95 6/1 7/1 Very Soft Clairwood: R125K- GUINEAS TRIAL (Listed) For 3yolds
2012-12-01 Turffontein 1600 85 58.0 A 6 6 5.00 THE HANGMAN Bernard Fayd'Herbe 97.26 16/1 12/1 Good Standside: R500K- DINGAANS (Grade 2) 3yolds
2013-02-19 Greyville 1600 85 60.0 A 4 1 -0.05 *LEHAAF (ARG) Anton Marcus 97.87 16/10 2/1 Good R63375- NOVICE PLATE 1 time Winners and maidens
2013-04-06 Turffontein 2000 85 58.5 A B 2 2 0.50 WYLIE HALL (AUS) Anton Marcus 124.31 11/2 28/10F Very Soft Standside: R150K- DERBY TRIAL (Listed) For 3 year-olds
2013-04-27 Turffontein 2450 88 58.0 A B 12 3 1.75 WYLIE HALL (AUS) Bernard Fayd'Herbe 156.35 10/1 7/1 Good Standside: R1.5M- SA DERBY (Grade 1) 3rd Leg TCrown
2013-06-01 Greyville 2000 95 58.0 A B 14 6 3.50 VERCINGETORIX Bernard Fayd'Herbe 121.98 18/1 22/1 Good R1.5M- DAILY NEWS 2000 (Grade 1) For 3 year-olds
2013-07-06 Greyville 2200 95 53.0 A B 16 16 12.75 HEAVY METAL Raymond Danielson 137.88 36/1 36/1 Unknown R3.5M- VODACOM DURBAN JULY (Grade 1) all Horses
2013-10-31 Turffontein 1800 101 60.0 A B 3 6 4.50 SMANJEMANJE Ian Sturgeon 111.30 9/2 18/10F Very Soft Inside: R94K- MR 99 DIVIDED HANDICAP Open
2013-11-15 Turffontein 1800 101 54.0 A B 9 6 3.25 TIGER'S RETREAT Karl Zechner 110.22 14/1 12/1 Good Standside: R300K- VICTORY MOON STAKES (Grade 2) Open
2013-12-14 Turffontein 1800 94 52.0 A B 7 3 0.75 CAGIVA Francois Herholdt 111.18 7/1 28/10 Very Soft Standside: R95K- CONDITIONS PLATE Open
2014-02-23 Scottsville 1950 94 53.0 A B 1 4 2.75 ASTRO NEWS S'Manga Khumalo 123.66 5/2 18/10 Good R120K- umTHOMBOTHI STAKES (Non-Black Type) Open
2014-04-20 Clairwood Park 1600 93 60.0 A B 4 4 5.50 FUTURA Bernard Fayd'Herbe 95.86 5/2 28/10 Good Clairwood: R85K- GRAD PLATE Maidens,1 & 2 time winners
2014-05-31 Greyville 2400 89 52.0 A B 1 1 -0.05 *GOTHIC Anthony Delpech 152.73 8/1 11/2 Good R250000 - Grade 3 (Merit Rated Handicap) | Main | Turf
2014-07-05 Greyville 3000 92 54.0 A B 2 3 0.25 HOT TICKET Anthony Delpech 190.54 7/1 10/1 Unknown (N) NOKIA GOLD VASE (Grade 2) (For All Horses)
2014-07-26 Greyville 3200 94 53.5 A B 16 2 0.50 WAVIN' FLAG Anthony Delpech 204.32 7/1 10/1 Unknown (N) THE R1,25 million ELAN PROPERTY GROUP GOLD CUP (Grade 1) (Open)
2015-06-06 Greyville 1800 99 54.5 A B 8 2 1.25 PUNTA ARENAS Anthony Delpech 108.96 10/1 22/1 Unknown (N) CUP TRIAL (Grade 3) brought to you by HALFWAY TOYOTA (Open)
2015-06-28 Greyville 1600 100 56.0 A B 12 2 0.25 BEZANOVA Anthony Delpech 98.68 7/2 4/1 Unknown (N) KWAZULU-NATAL BREEDERS MILLION MILE (Non-Black Type) (For KZN bred 3-year-old and older)
2015-08-01 Greyville 3200 100 55.0 A B 5 1 -1.25 *BALANCE SHEET Anthony Delpech 206.34 33/10 3/1 Unknown (N) eLAN PROPERTY GROUP GOLD CUP (Grade 1) (Open)

LEGAL EAGLE
Age: 3 (at last run)
Sex: g
M/Rating: 112 (at last run)
Owner: Mrs I Jooste & Mr M J Jooste
Breeder: Avontuur Thoroughbred Farm
Trainer: S G Tarry
Breeding: Greys Inn (USA) - Young Sensation by National Emblem
Colours: Emerald green, yellow stars, black sleeves and cap
Date of last run: 2015-07-04
Next race: Not carded
Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2014-10-28 Turffontein 1160 59.0 A 6 7 10.50 MUTAMAKKIN (AUS) Piere Strydom 68.28 6/1 10/1 Good BETTING WORLD MAIDEN PLATE (For all Maidens. R20 000 WIN BONUS RA MEMBERS)
2015-03-05 Vaal 1600 60.0 A 5 1 -1.00 *ARABIAN WORLD S'Manga Khumalo 95.43 6/1 3/1 Good THANK YOU FOR JOINING US TODAY MAIDEN PLATE (For all Maidens)
2015-03-17 Vaal 1700 74 55.0 A 13 2 1.25 SCOTSNOG S'Manga Khumalo 102.62 7/1 16/1 Good THANK FOR YOUR PATRONAGE MR 75 DIVIDED HANDICAP (Open)
2015-04-04 Turffontein 2000 76 52.0 A 11 1 -2.25 *STONEHENGE S'Manga Khumalo 122.90 4/1 9/2 Good DERBY TRIAL (Listed) (For 3 year-olds)
2015-04-25 Turffontein 2450 89 58.0 A 14 1 -3.00 *DEPUTY JUD Anton Marcus 154.59 5/1 5/1 Slightly Soft S A DERBY (Grade 1) BROUGHT TO YOU BY GORDON'S GIN (3 year olds (3rd Leg SA Triple Crown))
2015-06-14 Turffontein 1800 112 60.5 A 5 1 -4.30 *JUDICIAL Anton Marcus 108.78 2/1 2/1 Good JUBILEE HANDICAP (Grade 3) (Open)
2015-07-04 Greyville 2200 120 54.0 A 10 5 2.50 POWER KING Anton Marcus 135.64 5/2 7/2 Unknown (N) VODACOM DURBAN JULY (Grade 1) (Open to all Horses)



3. Champion 2yo Colt

RABADA MR 111and unbeaten, compared to Seventh plain 110
Age: 3 (at last run)
Sex: c
M/Rating: (at last run)
Owner: Mrs I Jooste & Mr M J Jooste
Breeder: Summerhill Stud (Pty) Ltd
Trainer: M G Azzie
Breeding: Brave Tin Soldier (USA) - Jordie by Fard (IRE)
Colours: Emerald green, yellow stars, black sleeves and cap
Date of last run: 2015-08-01
Next race: Not carded
Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2015-03-28 Turffontein 1400 58.0 A 8 1 -4.75 *DUTCH HARBOR Anton Marcus 88.66 6/1 11/1 Very Soft CHAMPIONS DAY 25 APRIL MAIDEN JUVENILE PLATE (For 2 year-olds. R20 000 WIN BONUS RA MEMBERS)
2015-06-06 Greyville 1400 60.0 A 1 1 -3.25 *EXIT HERE Anton Marcus 84.41 2/1 14/10 Unknown (N) GATECRASHER STAKES (Listed) brought to you by RISING SUN COMMUNITY NEWSPAPERS (For 2 year-olds)
2015-08-01 Greyville 1600 60.0 A 4 1 -0.75 *PROSPECT STRIKE Anton Marcus 97.85 9/10 9/10 Unknown (N) PREMIERS CHAMPION STAKES (Grade 1) (For 2 year-olds)

SEVENTH PLAIN
Age: 2 (at last run)
Sex: c
M/Rating: (at last run)
Owner: Mrs I Jooste & Mr M J Jooste
Breeder: Klawervlei Stud
Trainer: D R Drier
Breeding: Seventh Rock (AUS) - Amber Plain by National Emblem
Colours: Emerald green, yellow stars, black sleeves and cap
Date of last run: 2015-07-04
Next race: Not carded
Race Date Track Dist MR Wght AIBI Dr Fi W/D Winner/*2nd Jockey Time OP SP Condition Race
2014-12-20 Kenilworth 800 58.0 A 5 1 -1.50 *BUCKINGHAMPSHIRE (AUS) Sean Cormack 48.00 3/1 6/1 Good POLAR ICE CREAM MAIDEN JUVENILE PLATE (For 2 year-olds. R20 000 WIN BONUS RA MEMBERS)
2015-01-31 Kenilworth 1000 58.0 A 1 2 1.25 BUCKINGHAMPSHIRE (AUS) Sean Cormack 59.37 28/10 12/10 Good THE SUN INTERNATIONAL SUMMER JUVENILE STAKES (Listed) (For 2-year-olds)
2015-04-26 Scottsville 1100 60.0 A 8 1 -1.50 *BEAT THE RETREAT Anton Marcus 63.33 12/10 12/10 Good GODOLPHIN BARB STAKES (Grade 3) brought to you by TECHNIQUE SHOPFITTERS (2-year-olds)
2015-05-23 Scottsville 1200 60.0 A 4 1 -2.50 *REDCARPET CAPTAIN Anton Marcus 70.07 4/1 22/10 Good TSOGO SUN GOLD MEDALLION (Grade 1) (For 2 year-olds)
2015-07-04 Greyville 1400 60.0 A 4 1 -0.05 *BRAZUCA (AUS) Anton Marcus 84.70 16/10 12/10 Unknown (N) DURBAN GOLDEN HORSESHOE (Grade 1) (For 2 year-olds)



4. Media award TV- S/Manga Khumalo - Kevin Harris - Is he a regular journalist and is a financed movie eligible particularly when its backed by Racing Its a Rush

Please can someone explain what criteria is applied and weather it is consistent fair and logical.

kind regards

Richard Taylor

There are some valid questions asked here. Every year the awards time come past ( or July final field time ) we have these situations. Inconsistency in the criteria of awarding titles, and owner influence clearly play their roles. In the case of the two year old colts award, its not hard to see why the one got it when you see where he is bred. The champion sprinter not hard to speculate on either when you see where he comes from and what the future plans are for him. The Champion stayer has been awarded on one victory and should have gone the other way. As for the media award, clearly this was an instruction from above to justify the Its a Rush waste of money. Until there are clear guidelines as to how the various awards are won we will continue to have these situations.