Bookies manipulating prices....

mr hawaii wrote: That horse Juba changed owners and was sold with engagement so maybe the new owner thought he had bought Frankel instead of a MR 46 ? Maybe that's why the strong betting support?

.....must have been told that it was a sure thing and ready to win..... :S ....it ran a shocker....going to take many more runs to find a stake cheque based on that performance.... :oops:

can anyone in their right mind tell me how R9 TURFF. MONARCH AIR ends up weak bookies favourite 9/2 ........... NOT tipped by any TIPSTER to win today, one guy tipped for 4th !!!

last 3 runs, 44, 25. 25 .................. HOw on earth was this 9/2 even with Khumalo on top............FALSE FAV FOR SURE.

I backed the WINNER - SEPTEMBER BLOOM 5 / 1

ElvisisKing wrote: can anyone in their right mind tell me how R9 TURFF. MONARCH AIR ends up weak bookies favourite 9/2 ........... NOT tipped by any TIPSTER to win today, one guy tipped for 4th !!!

last 3 runs, 44, 25. 25 .................. HOw on earth was this 9/2 even with Khumalo on top............FALSE FAV FOR SURE.

I backed the WINNER - SEPTEMBER BLOOM 5 / 1

Elvis Strydom made it his value bet today that's why u got 5/1 the winner.

The bookies gave us Marinaresco to win the July but we didn't listen so they sent out the horse's price to the moon. Bookies make the opening price but punters set the closing price. Bookies just balance supply with demand at closing.

So judging by the comments presented on this topic, I gather bookies are absolved from manipulating prices and it's owners, trainers and punters that are most probably manipulating prices......my question then is unless we can see all bookies books to see if money has come for a particular horse that shortens the price, it is misinformation about the horse by either trainers owners or punters that causes the price to shorten....I as a novice in this game always thought only money put on a horse can only shorten a price on that horse....not just false talk....what am I missing.....

Mac, are u now saying that the PUBLIC followed Monarch Air at 9 / 2 & kept it favourite ?

Just because the bookies made it a 9/2 shot.... doesn't mean in fact it was a TRUE 9/2 shot..... obviously it wasn't ......starting at 44. 25, 25/1 in his last 3 starts..... why did it start so short in the betting ? Only gullible fools could have backed this horse at THIS PRICE.... should have been at least 10 or 12 / 1 ............ bet they were sorry later - horse was never in the race.

Tipsters never fancied this horse that's for sure ! If it was in fact backed - bookies were smiling ALL the way to the bank.

rhodieace wrote: So judging by the comments presented on this topic, I gather bookies are absolved from manipulating prices and it's owners, trainers and punters that are most probably manipulating prices......my question then is unless we can see all bookies books to see if money has come for a particular horse that shortens the price, it is misinformation about the horse by either trainers owners or punters that causes the price to shorten....I as a novice in this game always thought only money put on a horse can only shorten a price on that horse....not just false talk....what am I missing.....

In the old days bookies used to make prices for themselves and connections to punt, not sure it happens these day

Some ways horses shorten without tonnes of cash -

Face to punt a horse in a branch or online for it to shorten

Respected trader at a firm goes shorter than the other books ( rest will follow like sheep)

Punters will sometimes shorten a horse, then fire another in a race.

Trainers or owners fire a runner

Jockeys info( bookies, punters)

Abc ( look at the horse I put on Flamingo)

Most professional bookmakers have to operate within specified parameters to balance their books. Whatever they do is reflective of the wagers being placed with them. Unless they are renegades and dont follow practice ...those will likely fold up very soon though.

If large volume of bets placed with the bookies on a specific horse they might choose to cover those bets by taking counter bets on the tote, this is usually whats happening when a horses price starts snowballing downwards

Bookies who follow the rules, never lose regardless of the result .....only those who gamble are subject to losse

It is not in the interest of any insider to have a horses price plunge.....unless he has fully exersized his option, usually the plunging horse results from a bookmakers covering a large bet on the tote, and the public jumping onto that in desperation.

It has been observed over and again that large volume of bets doesnt necessarily make the horse a winner....its usually an influential bettors wager, coupled with the public jumping onto it. The influèntial bettor maybe and usually is wrong...since real inside wagers are usually discreet.....

Drageda in the 2nd today at Scotsville.I really wonder would could have been going on there.Backed from 10-1 into 17-20 but apparently the stable didn't really fancy it.I see it drifted to 16-10 and then came into 17-20 before the off which most times means it's good money.Bookies manipulating the price or someone outside the stable backed it?

I see that stable just won the fifth with another first timer.

The bookmakers don't have to "do" anything.

durbs wrote: I see that stable just won the fifth with another first timer.

That filly Queens Plain is from the family of Grade 1 winners, Follow The Falcon, Savannah Queen and On Her Toes.