Durbanville 29th

magiclips Wrote:

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> K.C Wrote:
>

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>

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> > Can somebody please explain to me how a horse
> that
> > has not won it's Maiden can run in a MR
> Handicap?
> > I am confused, this is the second time I see
> this.
> > Horse in question, Race 4 Number 8 Golden
> Flute.
>
> Why shouldn't they? If they've run at least 3
> times to qualify for a merit rating, there's
> nothing to stop them running in handicaps. In the
> UK and elsewhere in Europe maidens run in
> handicaps every day, and often win them.

Thanks very much Magic. So, as soon as they get allocated a MR they qualify. I was under the impression that a horse must win it's Maiden to qualify to run in MR handicaps ( I was really wrong there ) Once again thanks

Solotrama Wrote:

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> Kc any horse that has a merit rating can run in a
> handicap . It does not need to win a maiden to run
> in a handicap . This has happened plenty times in
> the past but sadly not enough . It could be that
> some/most trainers still think they need to win a
> maiden race before they can race their horses in
> handicap races ?

I think you hit the nail on the head, Solo. We still seem to have this idea that horses have to be winners before they race against winners, especially with horses aged older than 2. It doesn't matter how many times you point out that maidens win handicaps day in and day out elsewhere in the world, the message doesn't seem to sink in. That said, while I'm not overly familiar with UK racing I have the distinct feeling that they have many handicaps of a lower grade than we have (like the equivalent of a MR 52 or something handicap, which we don't). That would make it easier for a maiden to win, but what I do know is that a lot of UK horses run in maidens three times to get a mark (merit rating) and are virtually never seen in maiden races again thereafter.

The notion that a maiden plate is always the weakest kind of race is a complete fallacy. As I've written before, every horse that's ever lived was eligible to run in a maiden race at some point, but there was no way in hell that Nijinsky or Sea The Stars or Frankel was ever going to run in a mickey mouse handicap. In fact, there are a lot of low rated non-maidens running in handicaps that theoretically would have no chance of winning if for some bizarre reason they were allowed to go back and race in a maiden plate. The peculiar SA habit of using number of races won as a strong indicator of a horse's ability just shows no signs of fading away, no matter how many times one may point out that it is bollocks.

Solotrama Wrote:

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> Kc any horse that has a merit rating can run in a
> handicap . It does not need to win a maiden to run
> in a handicap . This has happened plenty times in
> the past but sadly not enough . It could be that
> some/most trainers still think they need to win a
> maiden race before they can race their horses in
> handicap races ?

Thanks very much Solo. I was not aware.

K.C Wrote:

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> magiclips Wrote:
>

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>

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> > K.C Wrote:
> >
>

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>
> >

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> > > Can somebody please explain to me how a horse
> > that
> > > has not won it's Maiden can run in a MR
> > Handicap?
> > > I am confused, this is the second time I see
> > this.
> > > Horse in question, Race 4 Number 8 Golden
> > Flute.
> >
> > Why shouldn't they? If they've run at least 3
> > times to qualify for a merit rating, there's
> > nothing to stop them running in handicaps. In
> the
> > UK and elsewhere in Europe maidens run in
> > handicaps every day, and often win them.
>
> Thanks very much Magic. So, as soon as they get
> allocated a MR they qualify. I was under the
> impression that a horse must win it's Maiden to
> qualify to run in MR handicaps ( I was really
> wrong there ) Once again thanks

Mr Magic, please confirm, if the maiden (Mr rated) perd wins the race, this perd and the favourite are included as winning numbers for the Pick 6.

Of course, the conditions of entry for certain races may specifically exclude maidens, but in principle there is no reason why a horse with a MR can't run in a handicap. That's what the MR is for, after all.

magiclips Wrote:

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> Cape fields always like this at this time of year
> and only really pick up near the winter. I think a
> lot of Cape horses get vaccinated about now and/or
> wait for softer going.


Thats exactly the reason magic.

Don't leave out Secret Call race 6, unlucky with the appie on last time...

Thanks Mr Magic, any idea what time the Gosforth park racing starts today <

No, dontberight. If the maiden win only it (and any stable companions, as per the usual coupling rules) would be winning numbers in the P6. I think you are confusing it with the first time rulle, where if a first timer wins a Pick 6 leg the first previously raced horse to finish (NOT the favourite as such ) also qualifies. There is no circumstance where the favourite automatically qualifies without itself or a stablemate actually winning the race.

magiclips Wrote:

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> Solotrama Wrote:
>

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>

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> > Kc any horse that has a merit rating can run in
> a
> > handicap . It does not need to win a maiden to
> run
> > in a handicap . This has happened plenty times
> in
> > the past but sadly not enough . It could be
> that
> > some/most trainers still think they need to win
> a
> > maiden race before they can race their horses
> in
> > handicap races ?
>
> I think you hit the nail on the head, Solo. We
> still seem to have this idea that horses have to
> be winners before they race against winners,
> especially with horses aged older than 2. It
> doesn't matter how many times you point out that
> maidens win handicaps day in and day out elsewhere
> in the world, the message doesn't seem to sink in.
> That said, while I'm not overly familiar with UK
> racing I have the distinct feeling that they have
> many handicaps of a lower grade than we have (like
> the equivalent of a MR 52 or something handicap,
> which we don't). That would make it easier for a
> maiden to win, but what I do know is that a lot of
> UK horses run in maidens three times to get a mark
> (merit rating) and are virtually never seen in
> maiden races again thereafter.
>
> The notion that a maiden plate is always the
> weakest kind of race is a complete fallacy. As
> I've written before, every horse that's ever lived
> was eligible to run in a maiden race at some
> point, but there was no way in hell that Nijinsky
> or Sea The Stars or Frankel was ever going to run
> in a mickey mouse handicap. In fact, there are a
> lot of low rated non-maidens running in handicaps
> that theoretically would have no chance of winning
> if for some bizarre reason they were allowed to go
> back and race in a maiden plate. The peculiar SA
> habit of using number of races won as a strong
> indicator of a horse's ability just shows no signs
> of fading away, no matter how many times one may
> point out that it is bollocks.


Thanks guys, I was of opinion that winners must race against winners, wow I was so wrong.

donbetright Wrote:

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> Thanks Mr Magic, any idea what time the Gosforth
> park racing starts today <

Half past quarter to nearly half past twenty three. Don't be late.

K.C. we all learn something new every day. That's the joys of the Internet. A lot of cr@p flies around, but on the other hand there's some good stuff as well. If I say so myself.<

magiclips Wrote:

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> K.C. we all learn something new every day.
> That's the joys of the Internet. A lot of cr@p
> flies around, but on the other hand there's some
> good stuff as well. If I say so myself.<


Right you are