Flamingo Park Monday

Zietsman Oosthuizen wrote:

Over the Air wrote: Where were all the samaritans when Bloem was closed down?

Zietsman I fail to see why ten reasons are necessary but let me try justify my tagging of that big hole as a worthy of junk status. My comments in no order of relevance/importance:

1. The results. Nowhere do you see reversals of form like you do at the groot gat. Nowhere do you see these reversals of form supported by betting support far more often than the formbook dictates, often in an insultingly short period of bad/good/bad run cycles. Horses in the bad run cycle drift off the board as if the result is known - which it clearly is on occasion.
why didnt you just stop after your 2nd sentence because that i agree with but the rest is thumbsucked and that is nowhere near the truth, its just a shot in the dark by you

Zietsman do a search on Kimberley reversal of form on this forum and see the results of that. We have the ex owner of Leboana who posts here and has been vocal on occasion regarding the betting activities and subsequent performances as a very clear example. A kolskoot in the light more likely

2. The cripples - watch some of those poor horses go down on any Monday. The worst in the country by the distance
yes, alot of unsound horses but what did you expect when you must compete for such small stakes and where owners pay almost half the big trainers in other centres charge. We have 42 horses in our stable and only 9 i can honestly say is 100% sound. Thats been like that forever, if the horse is good but unsound he normally finds his way to kimberley or if he is 100% sound they normally useless.but lots of the trainers have proofed that we can achieve something with these horses that the bigger centres push out.

What are you actually saying besides enforcing my point? Unsound horses are not good for racing.

3. The positives - pound for pound the undisputed doping capital of South Africa when looking at numbers of trainers vs confirmed positives - could explain number 1.
bullshit , go check in the last 2 years , 11 cases in natal , 8 in gauteng , 5 in capetown, 4 in eastern cape and only 2 in kimberley. Again thumbsucked rubbish

No thumbsuck. You conveniently choose 2 years. In those two years Lensley and Smith were caught. Add in your stable along with high profile cases like Visser and Roux over the last few years and we have 5. Perusing the NHA stats there are 10 Kimberley trainers, here I ignore raiders and trainers with less than 10 runners in a season. Compare this to KZN with 48 ( satellite yards with more than 20 runners inc ) Western Cape 29, Eastern Cape with 18 and Gauteng with 59. The PERCENTAGES say their own thing.

Coupled to this is the fact that your higher percentages are achieved without a resident stipe, the other centres all have full time policing

4. The neglect cases - Shameful and ongoing. To rub salt in the wounds, a guilty former champion trainer gets the job as track manager as reward. I am told by those who have raced there that champion trainers are prepared to do deals on horses - no pay split stakes. Explains points 1 -4
again ungrounded rubbish statement, get the job as track manager as reward!!!!! You smoking something seriously. And why still hammering the man, he isnt a trainer anymore , he paid his price and he is a brilliant track manager, he is the best i seen in kimberley from the peter miller days. And he is approachable and understand what trainers want . Im telling you in my opinion Japie is doing a fantastic job with what he have.
Deals been every centre forever, ALL CENTRES, i know of graded race winners thats been trained on a deals by champion trainers in big centres, now you say its only the champion trainers in kimberley that do deals!!!! .i know of atleast 5 owners that have 50+ horses each that do deals with trainers. Its every owner/trainer choice how they want to do business.

Zietsman what would your reaction be if a person who has been convicted of paedophile activities is given the job of groundkeeper at a school and does a great job? I have never said "the trainer" is not approachable nor does a bad job with what he inherited. What I do say is that the track is an eyesore and does not perform as well as what it did in Peter Millers days. Visser did not inherit the track from Miller, I am not saying he is the cause of the decline. I am saying that the message sent out is one that sins of the past have been forgiven. I disagree with that message. Insofar as deals go, these should be outlawed in every centre. When horses start costing trainers thats when businesses go bottoms up and animals suffer.

5. The class of horse - nothing worse in the country, the ultimate last chance saloon.
surely , but dont they also deserve a chance???

Why? Perhaps survival of the fittest in all spheres of live should be relooked at. If owners are insistent on racing their slow horses let them pay not do deals.

6. The surface - an eyesore. From all accounts a shadow of its former glory in Millers days now has duststorms when horses run and 1 mm of rain causes an abandonment. I have no doubt it is no better than the Vaal sand and should be shut. The bleeding hearts can make space at the vaal and half stakes races held on grass on Mondays
its a sandtrack and its older than you , dont understand the apparent eyesore, its been sand since the start.
And its wayyyyyy better than vaal sand track ever been. The vaal sand track sounded like a gravelroad when horses came past, anybody saying vaal sand was better have never raced or seen or felt the kimberley track.

Zietsman I have no idea which sand track was better the Vaal or Kimberley and to be frank I dont care they are both terrible. We can agree to differ on this one.

7. The tote turnover - Poor. Monday meetings from Fairview are always better supported with far bigger pools. There is no clearer indicator that punters are uninterested and/or distrustful of the form there
sure, but how much is done to try and boost it????

Where is Fairview boosted? In terms of acceptability, punters speak with their pockets not by being boosted.

8. The lack of regulation - the centre is so surplus to requirements that the Jockey club dont even have a permanent stipe stationed there. The costs cannot be justified apparently. This helps explain points 1 -4
would also love to see a permant stipe

Hallelujah we agree. The question now should be why is there not a stipe?

9. The lack of a Horse care unit - the centre with the slowest horses and most chuck outs from other centres ( many due to soundness ) does not have one.
never been one in all the years , now apparently urgently needed, i dont buy that

Zietsman you acknowledge that this centre is plagued by cripples and slower horses and that these horses deserve this as a "final" chance. Coupled to this you confirm trainers doing deals on this type of horse. If there was ever a need for a Horse Care unit it is here.

10. The logistics - running the show from Joburg in terms of Jockeys and raceday officials staff makes no sense. 5 hours in a bus what do we need this crap for.
they doing it for 40+ years and now its a problem, because you dont need this crap hahahaha

Zietsman there are a few things that ran for 40 years and more and were not right. Apartheid was one. Because something runs for an extended period does not make it right. You reallyhave to take the blinkers off.

11. I dont like the dump and more importantly in waiting for your response, unlike you I HAVE NO ULTERIOR MOTIVE IN WANTING THE PLACE TO CLOSE.
i also dont like the dump that you regard as facts , most is just your personal opinions not based on facts but hearsay and thumbsucking
BUT WHAT GOT MY BLOOD BOIL IS THIS LAST SENTENCE.... unlike you I HAVE NO ULTERIOR MOTIVE IN WANTING THE PLACE TO CLOSE.......
YOU REALLY MUST BE HOPEFULLY JOKING BY ACUSING ME OF HAVING A ULTERIOR MOTIVE IN WANTING THE PLACE TO CLOSE.
Do you perhaps mind telling me who you are in real life? ( i doubt i will get an answer)

Blood boiling is good. Google is even better. You clearly do not understand the meaning of ulterior motive. Let me assist by analysing the context of what I said by giving you an example. Let's just for a minute consider what would happen in the two of our lives should a decision be made to close Kimberley. I would not notice that it was gone after a week. You on the other hand would be severely affected. I get that. It does not make the facts change.

Insofar as who I am, you are welcome to check my bio, I speak with Bob and others here on a regular basis. Feel free to Pm me and I will give you my number if you wish to discuss what I am saying. If you are ever in the Cape it would be good to meet up. Differences of opinion do not make us enemies.

Chris van Buuren wrote: This dude says flamingo gives the punters what they want.....Outsiders????? :silly:

Maybe stick to telling stories, not telling us punters what we want.

fingers wrote: Also watching tennis mr H?

Dave Scott wrote: Do u have one of these electric tennis bats to swipe Mr H ?

mr hawaii wrote:

Dave Scott wrote: Do u have one of these electric tennis bats to swipe Mr H ?

yes but the prob is they have a predilection for my toes so unless i wear socks to bed (unlikely in this heat) these snipers get me before I hear them. And it seems they go out on the town for most of the night and only get hungry after 2am... Must be old age but I never remember being so allergic to the bite of these monsters when I was younger...

JCWv wrote: How can the pool suggest otherwise? There where over 300k tickets on the pick 6 and it was not an impossible pick 6 to catch. Horses still had decent form.

Now chris I am not telling you stories Im telling you the truth. Everyone has their own way of playing but I would personally rather play an place where outsiders come more than a place where only favourites come.