Meydan Saturday 29/3/14

Only sensible post on this thread was Mavourneen's ...... {doffs "well said" beanie in the direction of Lesotho...roughly} ...

mr hawaii Wrote:

---

> bad company Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > The funniest thing is that the guys who believe
> > religiously MDK has a magic wand and just waves
> it
> > and produces gr1 winners never gives him
> horses,
> > cmon boys why do you guys support trainers who
> > have not won gr1 yet you say its all about the
> > trainer????
>
> because I don't have the money to give him a horse
> simple with graded potential(also Woody, Tarry,
> Kannemeyer, Bass, Ferraris, Howells and a few
> others including the Shams if I still owned) - It
> is not about the ability of the horse but the
> ability of the trainer to get the most out of the
> horse be it a MR64 or MR105 - Perhaps my example
> of Man U does not suite you so I'll add Ackermann
> as the Lions coach -I cannot believe that Racing
> is the only "Sport" where the "coach" is absolved
> of any liability and the major responsibility for
> performance relies on the "players". That cannot
> be true.

That's exactly the point ! The horse needs to have potential for the trainer to get the best out of it, few years ago woodruff was battling to win mr 80 races and then he got some good stock and started to win graded races! What happened during that 2-3 years did he forget to train grade1 horses? I remember when winning form had Geoff Woodruff has their star of the week they asked the reason for the stables turning point , and he said he never had quality horses!

When Pat Riley died Bart Rice took over most of Pats horses and saddled the most winners of his caeer in SA the following season.

The ammount of quality horse that go through the hands of the big trainers in one season guys like Ivan Moore , Craig Eudey won't even handle for the rest of their career.

A multiple champion trainer in Mauritius Gilbert Rousset has even told me its all about the horse, its gonna be very hard for him to compete in future because the other guys are buying the best for big money .

bad company Wrote:

---

> mr hawaii Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > bad company Wrote:
> >
>

---

>
> >

---

> > > The funniest thing is that the guys who
> believe
> > > religiously MDK has a magic wand and just
> waves
> > it
> > > and produces gr1 winners never gives him
> > horses,
> > > cmon boys why do you guys support trainers
> who
> > > have not won gr1 yet you say its all about
> the
> > > trainer????
> >
> > because I don't have the money to give him a
> horse
> > simple with graded potential(also Woody, Tarry,
> > Kannemeyer, Bass, Ferraris, Howells and a few
> > others including the Shams if I still owned) -
> It
> > is not about the ability of the horse but the
> > ability of the trainer to get the most out of
> the
> > horse be it a MR64 or MR105 - Perhaps my
> example
> > of Man U does not suite you so I'll add
> Ackermann
> > as the Lions coach -I cannot believe that
> Racing
> > is the only "Sport" where the "coach" is
> absolved
> > of any liability and the major responsibility
> for
> > performance relies on the "players". That
> cannot
> > be true.
>
> That's exactly the point ! The horse needs to have
> potential for the trainer to get the best out of
> it, few years ago woodruff was battling to win mr
> 80 races and then he got some good stock and
> started to win graded races! What happened during
> that 2-3 years did he forget to train grade1
> horses? I remember when winning form had Geoff
> Woodruff has their star of the week they asked the
> reason for the stables turning point , and he said
> he never had quality horses!
>
> When Pat Riley died Bart Rice took over most of
> Pats horses and saddled the most winners of his
> caeer in SA the following season.
>
> The ammount of quality horse that go through the
> hands of the big trainers in one season guys like
> Ivan Moore , Craig Eudey won't even handle for the
> rest of their career.
>
> A multiple champion trainer in Mauritius Gilbert
> Rousset has even told me its all about the horse,
> its gonna be very hard for him to compete in
> future because the other guys are buying the best
> for big money .

The point is they did not get born big trainers but made it there no matter how or why - They forged themselves ahead of the rest not through LUCK but through ability(be that people skills, acumen at sales, management, adaptation etc- ) Again why is this the only career where some people think that all trainers(different work, feed, routine, work riders, grooms etc) are equal and only the "luck" in finding a good horse separates the good from the not so good. There is no argument for me as I see the same names in the top ten year after year so that can't just be LUCK

I said I was not going to argue about this topic again but everyone from Syd Laird to now that has actually trained a horse will tell you the same thing. Find me 1 trainer who tells you that it is not nearly all about the horse and besides telling him/her to their faces that they are liars, I will say I am wrong. BC is right, what did Geoff forget how to train for those years? No horse,no trainer and that is it! Bob your managers are not working with living athletes who have different levels of ability. I can see I am wasting my time as some just do not want to see and accept the truth. :X Cheers

North Island was another no-hoper who ended up at Hilton [Pmb] after being culled from a big stable [A.D.Gordon]." I looked at the breeding and wondered why he'd been running over 1200 mt and 1400 mt when he'd been bred to go over ground ", say's Anne.

The NZ bred won 4 races for her from 1800 mt to 2450 mt.

" He came into The Holiday Inns with just 49,50 kg, very different to what Furious had," recalls Anne." I told the jockey Patrick Wynne to take him to the front, let him run and see if the others could get to him. He held on to win well."

Here was a female trainer who won the country's biggest race with a throw-out from another stable. And the feat was accomplished twice with the other runner a horse called Furious who needs no introduction and has a venue named after him at the Big T.

bumped FOR REFERENCE....................................... www.africanbettingclan.com/forum/phorum-....php?3,302450,303241

Ability of horse,trainer and jock all in balance !! Winning combo !! Like with horses,trainers and jocks their abilities differ,only natural. Thats life ! The "thing" that separates most from being brilliant,good, average or bad is the ability to over-come/work within your short-comings. That being mental capacity,physical capabilities etc. Lets not forget LUCK !
Kak thread ! Chicken or the egg ??
None or combo of all.