YOU BE THE JUDGE NO. 2

Just to let you know that the next programme will be screened on Tellytrack on Tuesday 24th June. The topic is BOOKMAKERS versus THE TOTE and panelists will be David Attenborough (Phumelela), Mike O'Connor (Bookmakers' Association), Derek Brugman (Racing Association) and Denzel Pillay (National Gambling Board). If you have any comments, queries or opinions, please feel free to include them in this thread or send them to info@racingassociation.co.za. We will do our best to include them in the show. Marklar

What time is the show ?

This could get ugly Marklar!

Simply tell the bookies to get lost, make Betfair and the Tote the only legal form of betting and reduce the Totes operating margin.

Then hire a call tracing/tapping company to monitor all the jockeys and trainers cell phones and voila, most of the trash in SA racing will be cleaned up.

Then hire Scotland Yard to keep a close watch on things and then and only then will the industry seem more transparant to the racing and potential racing public.

Until then it will be an industry for die hards and rich owners spreading the big races around with the mug punters getting screwed from behind as the bookies fill their already deep pockets by operating at an unheard of 30% most of the time!

Its as simple as that!

nice questions catsmug and most of the time opening betting is false and fav drift dramatically

Bookies vs Tote, a good subject, however exchanges must be added to the discussion.

I could go into betting percentages, but sure many people have plenty to post on this subject, so will try and keep the input brief.

Lets look at the Pros and Cons

Tote

Exotics, I see as the only positive for a tote.

Bookies

You can have a fixed price on a substantial bet, it would be mad to put a large win on the tote reducing your own odds.
A fixed place price same as above.
You can take doubles and trebles etc, on races of your own choice, including a mixture of sports bets.

Exchanges

Betfair is the Rolls Royce for punters, but no doubles or trebles per say, Interbet is a superb substitute on the local front as I am more a player than a layer.

So imo, their is a niche in the market for all of the above and proper tax controls and exchange regulations should be put in place to allow the "punter/owner" a choice and institute contribution formulas to add to the sponsorship of races and in doing so encourage the purchase of horses and help keep the game alive.

I would like to add that betting on "blind" totes such as France is a disgrace to the local punters as they have no indication of a horses real chance of winning a race and has now become a lottery for the poor punters in the tote outlets.

Dave Scott

Good evening Marklar, just read your opening post and would you mind informing me who you are and if you are involved with putting the show together?

thanks

Dave Scott

Hi Markler,

When so many races in Phumelela territory are named after the Tote Soccer 6, Phumelela products and the Racing Association, I would like to ask why Bookmakers who would pay money to sponsor races (which could help increase stakes) are seemingly not afforded the same opportunity.

Many thanks.

My question is why Betfair has met such resistence.
It is the most natural complement to the Tote as both merely facilitate bets between punters,and Betfair is the fixed price alternative.
Could it be the shareholding? I think that P would love to have a betting exchange,as long as they own it!

Scotia i have the sam question.
If it is true that You be the Judge will be this toppic next time it only means one thing.
RA you are on the right track.
Go i support you.

Just a thought, which 1 of the "honourable" panelists above is representing the group that at the end of the day fund all these entities?

Yes, im talking about the punter...

Hi Mark ler, thanks for the opportunity.

I would like to know how much of the 'international TV market'revenue from license agreements, tote pools etc. went directly back into the SA 'Stakes' pot last year. And what that amounted too as a percentage of the overal amount received.

Cheers, Jim.

Any chance of the tote partnering betfair or similar operation in S.A.?