End of the Open Bet for Bookmakers?

Flash Harry

you are 100% correct,

this is my tote rebate from Betfair....for last week.

2012-03-19
13:09 90019228547 2012-03-19
13:09
700 - XHR001 - Horseracing P&L - Tote rebate ADJ36 - - - 362.07

There is NO reason that the tote cannot offer the same rebate to you. Now the facts are still that if the tote ran their businss properly and LOOKED after you. IN THE LONG run its better for everyone including the punter because evrything improves.

BUT as things stand right NOW its impossible because there are too many hangers on and self fullfilling people in SA racing, NO of which are on this site.

The contributors on this site in essence love racing and i am sure the with a bigger picture in mind and the correct management SA racing can prosper.

easy Wrote:

---

> you guys are mixing poor management and greed with
> the fact that a tote only system works for
> horseracing.
>
> The fact that your local tote depot is shite is a
> refelction of the contempt that the controling
> bodies have for the punter, the reason that the
> bookies offer a better ambiance is they are shrewd
> businessmen that recognise the vallue of a
> customer. They give a bit (nice food and seating)
> and take alot.


After having done such a wonderfull sales job in Cape Town if Breeders and Big Owners put in a small effort they can still save/improve the racing experience,make it attractive to get young blood & fresh money into the game.
There should then be enough{ha ha] for everyone and just maybe no more need for this debate
btw,I give bookies no more than I would give the tote,and as you say;no matter what[nice food and seating] it is at least for free,as in
mahala and then some. CHEERS -D

My mates tell me that teasers and the grand have the best chefs and service in town. That is an example of a business that sells guava's yet recognised that the client placed just as much value on the potatos and whiskey as the guava.

easy Wrote:

---

> My mates tell me that teasers and the grand have
> the best chefs and service in town. That is an
> example of a business that sells guava's yet
> recognised that the client placed just as much
> value on the potatos and whiskey as the guava.


Correct, it should be a package deal where one is there for a purpose but it can be pleasant or painful.... the pleasant purpose is more likely to be repeated over and over. Eventually the painful one gets too much and one desists with the purpose.

rob faux Wrote:

---

> One of the strange truths of racing is that owners
> will go on about the tote being the only game in
> town,but every owner I have ever known,place their
> outright bets ONLY on the books ,and use the tote
> for exotics only.
> Those that don't bet are involved in the take out
> only,and I have never seen one effort by owners
> to improve the lot of the tote punter.

What a lot of rubbish.

the owner supply the product on which the betting take place they already pay for keep for the horse what have they to do with the tote and improving the facilities?

If WIN bets are placed on the tote they would contribute to the stakes pool so the principle of supporting the stakes pool remains..............what on earth difference is it whether the alternative is called "open" or not.
A lot has been made of countries that have no bookmakers at all..........so if owners wish punters to use the tote, set the example.
If,however, owners place their bets for the best possible returns why not all punters?
It remains a mystery to me that owners believe that punters owe them their stakes,regardless of the raw deal that is dished up.
Why should Local punters pay the exhorbitant take-out when we are aware that there is room for rebates.............I for one will not support Saftote unless it absolutely suits me and my attitude will continue until they give me some sort of evidence that they value my custom!

(NB James ,local owners rely on our bets for stakes ,punters don't rely on SA racehorses to bet on )

JAMES BLOND Wrote:

---

> rob faux Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > One of the strange truths of racing is that
> owners
> > will go on about the tote being the only game
> in
> > town,but every owner I have ever known,place
> their
> > outright bets ONLY on the books ,and use the
> tote
> > for exotics only.
> > Those that don't bet are involved in the take
> out
> > only,and I have never seen one effort by
> owners
> > to improve the lot of the tote punter.
>
> What a lot of rubbish.
>
> the owner supply the product on which the betting
> take place they already pay for keep for the
> horse what have they to do with the tote and
> improving the facilities?


some owners pay

I said before the is no guarantee if the turnover is higher that P would up the stakes, 2 years ago they had a big profit and still lowered the stakes.

If this is to become reality, then the tote should not be doing soccer and rugby bets.

Until they realize that the punter comes first and NOT their shareholders, I will continue to support the bookies.
There are too many inconsistencies with the tote. The powers to be will not give a straight answer and even address the problems.

There IS a guarantee.There is a stakes agreement that is linked to T/O .....big profits don't count.

A lot of you have it totally wrong in sofar as the owner is concerned. Depending on who you talk to the owners recover about 20% per annum of the money they spend on buying horses and the upkeep of these horses. THE OTHER 80% IS SUBSIDISED BY THE OWNERS. So if the total current stakes pot only covers 20% of these cost where will racing find the 80% for his expense if all owners withdraw today. So the next time you are tempted to say FCUK the Owner, may I suggest that the words that come out of your mouth is actually THANK YOU Mr Owner.

I like the concept of toll roads. If you use the road, then you pay, if you don't then you pay nothing. If you use the racing product, then you must pay. In theory there is nothing wrong with the open bet, the problem is that bookmakers using the racing product refuses to pay a fair price. If they paid a fair price there will be no difference in the dividends (or takeout).

Jack...no one said they are "flying"...just said the pools are huge......and by the way on this subject are you wearing a bookies cap ,owners cap or breeders cap?