Quick poll, do you believe that some South African horse races are fixed?

Trying to fool the market by putting an unfashionable rider on a fancied horse is hardly race fixing or cheating in any form. It's part of the "us verus them" game which is inherent to any form of gambling, and you are completely entitled to put whoever you choose on your horse.

Perception is larger than the truth...a person with eyesight impediments perceives the world differently and would thus require spectacles to correct their vision. (only if someone can convince them that they actually require spectacles). If you don't know the difference, ignorance is bliss.
While I don't say that cheating never occurs, I maintain that it is not as prevalent as some make it out to be...Everyone tries to get an advantage and not all of it is cheating.
I reckon the Lotto has more cheats than horseracing. (my perception) Between the corrupt administrators and officials...I would like to know the efficiency thereof...How much public money in vs how much payouts/charities out.

magiclips Wrote:

---

> Trying to fool the market by putting an
> unfashionable rider on a fancied horse is hardly
> race fixing or cheating in any form. It's part of
> the "us verus them" game which is inherent to any
> form of gambling, and you are completely entitled
> to put whoever you choose on your horse.


Your opening few words in the sentence says it all. Price fixing in any other market would result in sanction. End of the line is a clueless punter who is endlessly greasing the wheel with little to no return. (or is this part of the package not important enough to take care of?). Try pulling one over on the Casino's in the same way and see what happens. Generally results in a dealer and a punter being banned from the game.

Anyway back to an earlier comment of mine which Titch replied to. I bumped into the old punter from the the tote and he tells me that it was one Hilton Passmore who apparently bailed on an odds on at Clairwood. Apparently he was warned off for 2 years. Magic perhaps you would know; is this story true or urban legend?

i think it was brian passmore he was refering to and he was warned off for life as a jockey

Cheers Pirates was it for the jumping off incident?

yes so im told...before my time im not robs age;)

Good one! The same guy tells me that in that time their were no photo finishes and horses would lose by a length and still be declared as winners. I suppose we have a lot to be grateful for? They are lucky that there was no ABC back then!

Al, Are you seriously suggesting that I must be obliged to put Marcus on a horse I fancy, if he's available, instead of a lesser known jockey of my own choice, for whatever reason? If that is the case, you respectfully have gotta be kidding. Furthermore, the casino analogy doesn't work here. All casino payouts are fixed and based on mathematical certainties. If something pays out 5/1 now, it will pay 5/1 in ten minutes, in ten days, or in ten weeks time. And the house's edge is always built in - it is casinos that are for mugs.

Because of the variable factors which apply to gambling on horses, betting markets are much more subjective and volatile. Hence a horse which is 10/1 now might be 5/1 in two minutes from now, or it might be 14/1. Punters are entitled to a fair shake of the dice, but dictating whio can put what jockey on their horse goes way beyond what the public is entitled to. Yes, the punter has a right to demand (in theory, at least) as clean a contest as possible contested by horses that are basically fit and well, but there are limits and if someone can get 10/1 on their horse by putting Joe Mugg up instead of having to settle for much shorter odds with Marcus or Strydom riding, that is their business. They are after all taking the risk that Mugg won't f%%k it up and lose a race that a more successful rider would have won.

It is of course very different if they back the horse at big odds and then at the last minute replace Mugg with Marcus.

The only "jumping" allegation that I am aware of was the Jamaican Music "July" incident......the story's about that abounded.
Hilton Passmore was never warned off other than normal suspensions...........that was the domain of Brian..........I don't remember any "falling off" but he got a few extended holidays in his time as a jock.
Passmore stable was certainly,in my time ,the most successful punting stable in Natal ,by a distance............all the really big professional punts were limited to sprints down the Clairwood straight,where nothing was left to chance!
Their purchases at the sales were aimed at speed,for that reason......they had some of the fastest Drum Beat and Joy11 progeny to race.

The filly Soul springs to mind Rob...and the original Intellectual as well when the late Rudy Nieuwenhuis was the stable jock...
with regard to the Jamaican Music fiasco Tom Rattley was unseated behind the drill hall and as there was no cameras in those days accusations abounded...what added fuel to the flame was when JM went on to win the following year...

Titch Wrote:

---

> The filly Soul springs to mind Rob...and the
> original Intellectual as well when the late Rudy
> Nieuwenhuis was the stable jock...
> with regard to the Jamaican Music fiasco Tom
> Rattley was unseated behind the drill hall and as
> there was no cameras in those days accusations
> abounded...what added fuel to the flame was when
> JM went on to win the following year...

Actually I think it was two years later...

magiclips Wrote:
-
> Actually I think it was two years later...


Yip...that it was...Bert Abbo rode I think??