Derek brugman wanted to have a punt

Titch wrote: You may and can think what you will about MJ Byleveldt but the one thing that can never be questioned is his integrity, the man is as honest and straight up as they come, the fact that he answered the question posed in the post race interview is testament to the man's character imo, he could quite easily have used the normal excuses, first timer, greenness, luck in running etc etc but in true MJ fashion he chose to tell the unmitigated truth and for this he is being slaughtered??
The fact that he said in the pre race interview that he would be disappointed if the horse was out the 1st three seems to be being overlooked and should have been testament enough of the horses well being and the factual way he chose to answer the post race question I believe should be commended...

Absolutely!

Spot on about MJ there Titch.

it seems to me its the guys that gave mj the instructions that are at fault, but this sort of thing goes on all the time, perhaps the NHRA should clarify its position on this, coz to me this is bringing racing into disrepute

I have long campaigned for greater transparency and received little backing on this forum, often left feeling I am on a one man crusade. Lots of points I would love to make, let's see how many I can think of off the top of my head...

1. I have stated on numerous occasions I have absolutely no issue with all "connected" to a particular horse having the first punt but this must be at the opening price.
2. Once punted there must be a vehicle for the information to be relayed to the public, that can be through one specific website, individual websites, ABC or other
3. It is no good saying watch the market, I have become increasingly aware that bookies shorten or over-shorten certain prices based on very little money, which is why the price will often go back out again. Similarly, I have no doubt there are individuals out there backing a horse simply to get a better price on another in the same race. Some clanners have admitted to doing this themselves in the past. It can be extremely difficult therefore for a punter to distinguish between a horse that has been backed by "connections" or other.
4. There is a big difference between tips and information. 99% of us I believe want information. Not picking on the stable in particular, just the latest example, Jet Belle yesterday... I heard just before the off that apparently the trainer hadn't been putting any pressure on the horse for this run and had other races in mind. From that (and the ride) I assume she would win if there was a chance to do so but it was really perhaps more of a prep run. My money was already down. It would not have been had I been aware of that comment the day before. I would consequently have diverted my attention and money to the eventual winner. Would have given me six/eight on the card and retirement. That is how a lack of information, not a tip, can be so costly to punters.
5. I agree with Titch. MJ was simply being honest, albeit after the event and he should not be victimised for this, to say he was wrong to say it is imo simply asking for greater deceipt in the industry. He should not be placed in that position in the first place is really the point.
6. Elvis, wipe that egg away bud, I for one have enormous respect for your opinions and if they don't work out, so be it. I started to give certain horses to some friends, the big priced ones. The first five or six didn't even sniff a place between them. The next won at odds available of 66/1 and 16/1 a place. Only one of my friends had enough faith to still be backing them. Winner! The point... we all make our own choices ultimately.
7. Removed this point as an esteemed fellow clanner has been good enough to bring to my attention that I was getting my wires crossed, sincere apologies if anyone was annoyed or offended by the original comment.

I have to go, possibly to be continued lol... one thing I think many here are missing before I go, in many ways you are all singing from the same hymn sheet, though on face value it may appear not, it just needs someone to pull it all together. Hello Mr Racing Authorities? I said, hello Mr Racing Authorities...?

Englander ,your point 4 highlights my feelings on this subject................we should not be relying on the effort of journalists or the honesty of stables...............if what you say is true ,Jet Belle was not raced on merit and breached a NHA rule(not that they would know)

How should they police that?
Well the horse has earned a merit rating .............if it runs at a determined level(the vital thing missing from the rules is this definition) below without valid explanation ,suspend in terms of the consistency rule!!!
Draconian ,YES, but will stop races being used as training gallops or to reduce MR's !!!!!!

The advantage is we won't have to worry about who might be telling porkie pies!

As far back as my failing memory will take me I cannot recall any trainer, jockey or owner ever saying that a 1st Timer is unbeatable so "I will be disappointed if he does not run in the first 3" when put into context is a bold statement...
The closest to a "Certainty" pre race statement regarding a 1st timer in fact came from the late Reggie Passmore when Soul made her debut "I've managed to get an A Div filly into a maiden"

Titch wrote: As far back as my failing memory will take me I cannot recall any trainer, jockey or owner ever saying that a 1st Timer is unbeatable so "I will be disappointed if he does not run in the first 3" when put into context is a bold statement...
The closest to a "Certainty" statement regarding a 1st timer in fact came from the late Reggie Passmore when Soul made her debut "I managed to get an A Div filly into a maiden"

Titch ,the Passmore stable were probably the most successful "coup" stable in Durban in their day!
I was fortunate to have a mate who did some of their commissions so managed to participate quietly and make a few bob as well .........They never really put down big money except down the straight at Cwd.......they left little room for error!!!

(Its why their stable had an abundance of Drum Beat,Joy11 and Mexico11 progeny)

Spot on Rob... Soul was By Drum Beat out of a mare Postulant which made her a full sister to Brian Cherry's Abbey Boy

Titch wrote: Spot on Rob... Soul was By Drum Beat out of a mare Postulant which made her a full sister to Brian Cherry's Abbey Boy

Don't worry ,us toppies having senior moments Titch ............Abbey Boy trained by Rickaby for Basil Hersov!!!

100% it was Fred Rickaby...bit beyond my memory span ..seem to recall the colors Blue with a green cap??

I don't know mj B at all ,so if he is the honest guy that always speaks the truth who put him under pressure not to say more?

I'm not saying his pre race interview was deceitful,we couldn't ask for more to be honest,but post race interview leaves a sour taste,not talking from my pocket cos I don't punt big race days

Remember vicky was the one who coaxed him into saying that he did not give too much away,so maybe we should be asking her what she expected him to say